Karaoke Forums

"Extortion" is also a criminal act. Accusing someone (such as SC) of extortion, even if you meant it somehow in a non-criminal way, could be construed as making a libelous statement.

You can also be certified by DT/PR for your CB material.

Of course people would feel intimidated if they were sued but it is NOT intimidation. If it were, there would be no civil process or civil courts. People who get arrested and charged (not necessarily convicted) feel intimidated. Feeling intimidated and being intimidated are two different things. Heck, people feel intimidated when they see a cop on the street, so should we get rid of police officers?

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You can be strange but not a stranger

Jim, that is, at best, your opinion. While you certainly have a right to it, others disagree with equal validity. As a matter of fact, my impression is that the majority of others seem to disagree with it. Again, that's only my impression.

While the majority is not always right, there is usually a good reason why so many people would agree.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Beautifully and succinctly put- and my position exactly.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

My point still stands. Only two brands, at this point would HAVE to be used in Leopard Lizard's scenario of only certified hosts being hired by venues. Still, unfair to the rest of the Karaoke market. That is STILL unAmerican.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

So do I. It becomes quite difficult to follow.


The cost of acquiring music to do business the “legit” way has not been a big expense for years. Whining about someone undercutting because of music expense holds no weight anymore. If someone is doing karaoke for $30 plus beer, it’s not the cost of music that makes it possible for the KJ to undercut another’s price. It’s more likely the day job that covers his KJ hobby.



I'm not doing any kicking and screaming. I have a pretty laid back approach to this whole matter because there is little I can do to affect it. I was merely expressing a concern for the future based on my personal knowledge of venue owner attitudes (another thing I have little control over) and the patterns that are developing in this lawsuit experiment. It seems to me the kicking, and screaming, and excuse making is primarily coming from those who are gung-ho supporters of a third party suing everyone in sight in the hope that it will make up for their own deficiencies or put their competition out of business. It’s too late to turn the clock back to a time when you were the only game in town. In fact, the settlements these suits are designed to extract are meant to keep your competition in business.
I think the end result will be to make the competition more competitive, and with fewer venues to compete for.

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KNOW THYSELF

Are DT and PR under one corporation or not? PR could conceivable come up with a way to make money selling "certifications" if they actually own the CB trademark. DT DOESN'T OWN the trademark, and has yet to produce and sell product with their own.

Therefore, how could DT offer any sort of certification? PR ( the company with the hopes of a litigation based income) and DT ( the company with the hopes of a product based income) are being represented as two different companies that interact.

However, if DT can certify, one must assume that both companies are under a single corporate umbrella that actually owns the CB trademark.

If this is true, what is the name of the mother corporation?

If it's not true, then please explain how DT can certify.

Thanks in advance for your help. I have to admit that this one has me completely confused.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Well, then I'm glad I cleared that up for you.
Of course I didn't mention anyone by name (such as SC) nor did I mention or imply any illegal activity. In fact, both of those were your additions.

I was expressing concerns over the concept of suing venues over the actions of KJs.
So let me rephrase that for you;

"My concern has been the importunate demands for settlements from venues with threats of "vicarious infringement". Many venues have a tendency to determine what level of hassle they are willing to take for the entertainment they are willing to provide. I believe the evolution of this lawsuit experiment must lead to focusing the suits where the likelyhood of getting paid is highest. That means suing those with the deepest pockets -- the venues. When word gets around that karaoke can lead to the venue being sued, that's when venues will start dropping karaoke because it won't be worth the hassle."

Perhaps you could address that concern rather than pick at my vocabulary?

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KNOW THYSELF

Do you honestly belive that is what I am advocating? I was illustrating some of the things a venue owner could do to get an idea of if they had a legit host or not. Checking for certification is one option. Our owner asked the three hosts at the venue to show their discs or hit the road. One hit the road. I am not certified--but at the moment we are still disc hosts.

As for the argument (not yours) that people who support the fight against piracy must not have the skills to compete--the skills or lack of skills of any host do not in any way justify piracy by another host.

Sorry for the Hijack....


And there-in is the "rub" for someone like me... an ODB KJ. There is no Certification being offered for an ODB KJ. From what has been written in the letters from SC and the statements in their Safe Harbor, the MAIN FOCUS and WORDING has been about HD KJs (with 1 quick sentence or two about the use of Original Discs being OK too... very easy to read past).

Cueball, LL is also a ODB host....I dont think LL has had much trouble with the SafeHarbor paperwork. Maybe passing it out with the sentence about certification not being needed if the host is using OM discs being highlighted would be helpful....just a suggestion.
When we have passed out the packets we have insured that the venues were aware that certification was only needed for HD hosts.

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"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

Wait a minute. See that is where you are wrong. Certification is only needed if you have Sound Choice and Chartbusted on your Hard Drive. There is NO certification for any other brand. So if you have ALL your other brands on hard drive, and play SC and CB from disc, NO certification is needed.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Smoothedge,
I was referring to the Safe Harbor paperwork that is passed out to the venues( I have heard sometimes it is mailed). If you look at the packets you will see what Cueball was concerned about and why I recommended possibly highlighting the sentence in question. Areas tend to be blanketed in an area with a packet going to all venues in an area at times.

We passed them out to every venue in our area well over a year ago to try an protect venues (or at least make them aware of the possibility of problems) .

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"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

It's like everything out there, is pushing Sound Choice, like they are the only brand that matters. It's ridiculous. They talk about unfair competition but everything they are doing is a form of advertising themselves. There is a possibility that venues will think that only hosts that use SC are legal hosts. I have never seen one of these packets, but it should be stated in them that they and CB are the two brands that require certification to be used on HD, while no other brands require that. This way, KJs who DON'T use their brand can still get work.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Smoothedge,
The packets do state the program is for hosts that use those brands....I am not sure where but a copy of the packet was posted here on KS (about a year back I think)....maybe someone knows where it can be found.

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"Integrity is choosing your thoughts, words and actions based on your principles and values rather than for your personal gain."
Unknown
"if a man has integrity, nothing else matters, If a man has no integrity, nothing else matters."
Lee McGuffey

@HarringtonLaw - If you could point us to a contact number for CB Certifications with DT/PR, I would be most appreciative. I have questions about my own certification and I have been unable to locate any contact numbers for who to get a hold of at DT/PR about it.

@SmoothEdge - Stellar/PHM also requires that you have permission to shift. They aren't nearly as aggressive about things as SC, but they require it none-the-less. http://www.stellarrecords.com/cap_info.html

-Chris

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-Chris

I don't have the proper number for it--I have contact numbers but they're not for public consumption as far as I'm aware--but I have emailed my contact to get more information and I will post it when available.

That is the CAP program, which is for pirates.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

Then I guess I am a pirate because I have a CAP?

-Chris

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-Chris