Karaoke Forums

I didn't see anything under "Safe Harbor", but under "Certified KJs" on the SC site. Did I miss something?

Those under other headings are meaningless. How do resolved issues and people who use GEMS and ARE NOT CERTIFIED get added to the number of CERTIFIED hosts? Under CERTIFIED HOSTS there are 66 in the U.S. plus less than 10 in other countries.

BTW- I counted 192 GEM owners ( NOT "certified" KJs), of whom many were already on the "certified" list- dupes.

Either way, only "certified" is "certified".

However, of what you posted, I find something extremely intriguing:

"Also there as some that do not wish to be listed on the site for whatever reason. In our area we are aware of at least 3 KJ's that do not want to be listed on the site."


I would be interested in the reasoning behind wishing to HIDE this wonderful advertising tool..... Have you asked the 3 in your area? Could they be uncomfortable about associating their business with the SC name, but became "certified" through intimidation?

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

"ALL of the below are listed on the Sound Choice Certified Host page"

Venues go to the Sound Choice Certified hosts page looking for hosts that are certified. Everyone listed there is certified. As far as duplicates on the subsets, some hosts that were AUDITED and passed are also Gem series owners.

As far as why 3 the hosts we know of do not want to be listed. One is not looking wanting any additional work and does not advertize at all, he looks to retire within the next year when his venue is closed(venue owner/host). One is a snowbird and does not want calls/emails when she is not in Florida. And I have not asked the third.

Come on timberlea we are not talking about founding a nation and passing it on to others. We are talking about an industry in which we all participate, how many hosts plan on passing their business on? Many are thinking about getting out because it has changed so much. For me speaking from a practical standpoint it would not be in my personal or business interests to bother with SC and their legal process. The only reason the certified hosts support SC is they are hoping to get rid of the business rivals and eventually earn fatter pay days. That is not going to happen as long as the economy is in the toilet. If I am already working 6 days a week and not planning on running a string of kj operations, there is no reason for me to be up in arms over the current state of the industry. I'm doing fine and if everything goes South I just retire a little earlier, it is not the end of the world. Have a blessed day.

Absolutely not true.

-Chris

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-Chris

Really Chris if there is no advantage to the certified hosts for supporting SC then why go to all the bother, of turning in fellow hosts? Morale outrage, a sense of civic pride, their religious beliefs? What is their motivation other than they hope to improve their business, and their bottom line? I don't know how many times I have heard certified hosts say the legal process is going to shrink the number of hosts, limit the crowd to a few venues, and the pay scale for the remaining hosts will go up. There is no reason to support SC if it is not going to improve your particular business situation. Speaking from a totally pragmatic stance. Have a blessed day.

There are probably two different type of "certified hosts". Those that support SC and those that are certified just to keep the yappers off their heals. I firmly believe that those who support SC do so because they feel it is in their best interest to do so. There is also the "pick a team and pull for that team" mentality as well. I am for neither the pirate team nor the SC team. I'm sitting in the stands watching flagrant fouls all over the place from both sides. As is the normal case, the SC fans only see the FF's of the pirates and the pirates only see the FF's of SC. The only thing everyone agrees with is it's a very very ugly game.

It is a very ugly game, that is on going, simply for money. SC's reason for getting into the legal process was and is recovery of money they feel is owed the company, because piracy has robbed them. Either side can say what they want, but the underlying reason for all of this is power, and money. In SC's case having the power over their product in order to extract money, plain and simple. Have a blessed day.

I have a problem with how you position things. You have a very narrow view of the karaoke world based your particular eco-system. You think what takes place in your 20 mile circle applies to every other geography. The broad generalizations you stamp on all things karaoke simply don't hold up once you experience the real world.

I am not interested in "getting rid of business rivals". Competition is good so long as the playing field is somewhat level. It would be nice if everyone played fair, but the reality is there will always be those that cut corners. I feel comfortable knowing that I have played by the rules and gone the extra mile to get certified. I would love for the pirates to simply go away but I also know it will never happen. I have my own plan to get pirates out of clubs all on my own. No support from SC, no mention of certification, no hanging legal stuff out there. Just plain hard work and selling myself.

I believe most of us would like to make more money. I could probably do exactly what I am doing right now for the same price without certification. But the fact is certification has opened a few doors for me. Doors that would not otherwise exist at all for me without certification. In the grand scheme of things, certification is a means to an end. It is somewhat of a marketing tool, but I don't use it the way you think ALL of the SC cheerleaders do. The $150 I spent getting certified has paid off with more than $20,000 in karaoke gigs. That is a smart investment to me (and for my area.....your results may vary).

-Chris

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-Chris

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I didn't see anything under "Safe Harbor", but under "Certified KJs" on the SC site. Did I miss something?

Those under other headings are meaningless. How do resolved issues and people who use GEMS and ARE NOT CERTIFIED get added to the number of CERTIFIED hosts? Under CERTIFIED HOSTS there are 66 in the U.S. plus less than 10 in other countries.

BTW- I counted 192 GEM owners ( NOT "certified" KJs), of whom many were already on the "certified" list- dupes.

Either way, only "certified" is "certified".

However, of what you posted, I find something extremely intriguing:

"Also there as some that do not wish to be listed on the site for whatever reason. In our area we are aware of at least 3 KJ's that do not want to be listed on the site."


I would be interested in the reasoning behind wishing to HIDE this wonderful advertising tool..... Have you asked the 3 in your area? Could they be uncomfortable about associating their business with the SC name, but became "certified" through intimidation?[/quote]
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"ALL of the below are listed on the Sound Choice Certified Host page"

Venues go to the Sound Choice Certified hosts page looking for hosts that are certified. Everyone listed there is certified. As far as duplicates on the subsets, some hosts that were AUDITED and passed are also Gem series owners.

As far as why 3 the hosts we know of do not want to be listed. One is not looking wanting any additional work and does not advertize at all, he looks to retire within the next year when his venue is closed(venue owner/host). One is a snowbird and does not want calls/emails when she is not in Florida. And I have not asked the third.[/quote]
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I'm kind of surprised at your reply. Athena would have been more honest.

ONLY hosts listed under CERTIFIED HOSTS, again 66 in the US are actually certified. Those listed elsewhere may be duplicated on that list, but if they are not, they are not "certified"- PERIOD..

As far as Certified hosts who DO NOT WANT TO BE LISTED, your answer on the first is suspicious- if retirement is upcoming, why pay for the certification? The second is possible, but you mentioned more. I figure that the "more" were certified out of intimidation, but do not wish to be associated with the SC label.

I also spoke to one of my singers who gave me the feedback regarding SC being unwelcome on your state's northeast coast. One KJ had a sign that read: All quality karaoke- no breadcrumbs, no filler, no Sound Choice- just quality.

That was in Florida. Were I you, I would begin a program of disassociation with the label while time allows it.

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Just like I'm limited to my area Chris so are you, I happen to be in Southern California which is a very large mobile market. Lots of karaoke venues, and hosts playing to different ethnic groups. There is the Hispanic community, the Asian communities, the Indian casinos, a large Jewish community all with their own specific karaoke needs. You have answered my question that you feel you have gotten something in return for your certification, it was a business decision for you. We are not only limited by our locations, but also by our goals and time lines. You are still young and have many years left in the industry, others like myself are planning our exit strategy. What is a good move for you would not be for others, you have a large investment in SC product and of course you want to be able to use it. I don't have a large investment in SC product, and have elected not to use or promote the label. That is my choice and it works for me. Have a blessed day.

I have been travelling across the western half of the US for 12 years now. During that time I lived in Dallas-TX, Fallbrook-CA (SoCal....50 miles north of San Diego and just south of Temecula), and now Redmond-WA. I have been to a wide variety of karaoke venues. I try to go to a "new" karaoke place every time I travel somewhere. I think I have a pretty good handle on the karaoke eco-system (at least in the western half of the US).

My point is that I intentionally keep my eyes and ears open so I don't get silo'd into thinking that Seattle karaoke is all there is and the only way things can work.

I have gotten something out of my certification. I think any karaoke host working in a larger metropolitan area should seriously consider looking at certification if they want an advantage in securing gigs. But just walking into a bar and saying "I'm Certified" doesn't cut it. There is additional marketing that has to be done to make sure the venue knows what certification means and why it may be important to the host and the venue......and I don't mean holding some legal threat over anyone's head.

-Chris

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-Chris

would Phoenix count as a larger metropolitan area?

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Paradigm Karaoke, The New Standard.......Shift Happens

Case in point Paradigm is a certified host whose certification actually hurt his business. Since he has not been using the certified label on his service, his bottom line has actually been improved. If I am reading his posts correctly. I don't think it is a narrow view Chris if I find problems with the SC approach to the piracy problem. Whatever the positive rewards obtained by hosts for certification have to be balanced with possible backlash from host and venues who are revolting against SC's legal process. A certified host who plans on being in the industry long term, has to ask themselves, where will I be if SC goes the way of CB and collapses? Have a blessed day.

Yes, it is. Would be happy to chat with you about how I am positioning my certification. It's all in how the message is conveyed.

I believe part of the problem Sound Choice has is simple public relations. They could have implemented the exact same programs with the exact same LEGAL verbiage but with a more positive public positive message and avoided much of the drama and lash back they have suffered.

-Chris

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-Chris

I still have a piece of paper that demonstrates that I went through the Chartbuster process. They may not exist any longer but that doesn't negate the fact that I did my due diligence. There is also continued rumor that Digitrax will implement a similar process in the future. I imagine they are fully aware (and appreciative) of those that did get certified under Chartbuster.

If Sound Choice collapses I will still OWN my discs and know that I followed their policies.

-Chris

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-Chris

I went through the audit simply because I didn't want any hassles & felt it was the best way to digitize my library with no future worries. I don't turn in other hosts that don't (and there are still pirates around here). I don't necessarily agree with all their tactics by any means - also firmly believe ODB hosts shouldn't have to pay for any audits to be certified and listed on the cert page if desired. But I do feel SC has every right to recoup the monies that are stolen from them with pirated drives - I don't think that makes me an avid cheerleader. I am a supporter of SC products (always have been) as probably over 60-70% of my library is SC - bought and paid for before any lawsuits ever came to light - and no I would never even think of pulling them from my library and replacing that library with inferior versions - in most cases - (re-spending monies that could be put to better uses) just because I don't agree with some of their tactics.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

So after 55 posts...back to ORIGINAL TOPIC..............How did small population OREGON get to be one of the highest number of CERTED HOST LISTINGS on the SC Cert Host page?

Why not Washington with Seattle metro or LA or New York or Chicago etc etc?

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"You know that I sing the Blues and I do not suffer fools. When I'm on that silver mic, it's gonna cut ya, just like a knife"-The SWINGCAT

I can certainly respect your point of view. I actually respect all KJ points of view on the topic but stand closer to some than others (not that it matters anyway). Everyone that is "SC certified" has to have done it because they felt it was in their best personal interest to do so. All that's different is what those personal interests are and I am fine with all of them. I wouldn't turn anyone in even before and I have even more reasons not to now.

I am sure that many times I come off as anti SC but I do understand that loaded drives are a problem for manus and for front Kjs. I understand that running multi rigs with a single library is a problem for manus and for up front Kjs. So my views are probably much more in line with yours than many might think. I don't have a bulletproof answer to the problem but I feel very strongly that SC's certainly isn't it.

I think SC originated from that area so it was a local stomping grounds for their "investigations". I'll deffer to a more accurate answer if one is given, though.

I'll be it has to do with filing criteria, and second with friend/family/business ties in those areas. I doubt it has anything to do with "these are the worst places in America so let's concentrate our efforts here first"