Karaoke Forums

I am looking for contact information about auditors, or other governing bodies for karaoke host and shows in the state of texas I am considering getting into the business of hosting and want to make sure that I do it in a legal manner. Thanks Hoss

You don't need an audit to be legal.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

just purchase your music legally, don't buy pirated hard drives....

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It's all good!

That's not exactly accurate, and it's hardly informative.

Hoss, there isn't anyone specifically in Texas for that purpose, but the rules aren't any different in Texas. It's pretty simple.

1. Buy the songs you're going to use on original media. Most of the time, that means CDs, although some providers use other media like SD cards and USB drives. Some manufacturers also distribute material through official downloads.

2. Avoid IRC- and torrent-sourced material, and don't buy pre-loaded hard drives. These may seem like a good deal, or even free, but when you get caught, you'll spend double, triple, or more what you would have spent by buying in the first place.

3. Use common sense. Publisher royalties--which legit manufacturers pay as part of the manufacturing process--cost between 12 and 16 cents per song. On top of that, there are recording costs, marketing and distribution costs, and general overhead. A legitimate hard drive with only 20,000 songs on it--if it existed--would likely cost more than $10,000. A hard drive purchased via Craigslist for $500 is not legit. Don't do it.

4. Although strictly speaking it's not your responsibility to make sure the venue where you're playing has paid its PRO fees--BMI, ASCAP, and SESAC--you can be held liable if those fees aren't paid. It's a good practice to make sure the venue has done so.

5. If you want to move Sound Choice-branded material from CD+Gs to a hard drive (a "media-shift"), you can do it, but you have to follow the rules, which are:

(A) Maintain a 1:1 correspondence relationship between the discs you have and the hard drive(s). If you are building two hard drives, you need to have a set of discs for each drive. Also, you must make your copies from original SC media--not by copying someone else's hard drive or downloading content from a torrent site. If you are shifting to MP3+G format, we recommend ripping at the maximum available bitrate, 320 kbps, to preserve the quality of the recording.

(B) Once you copy content from a disc to a drive, that disc has to be put "on the shelf"--i.e., retired from use and held as the backup for that drive. The disc cannot be used for any other purpose. It is best to store your discs in a secure location.

(C) Notify Sound Choice that you are conducting or have conducted the media shift. It's better to do this before so that if you have any questions, you can get them answered in the beginning, but you can do it after.

(D) Submit to an audit of your holdings. A Sound Choice representative will inspect your hard drive and your discs to verify that you're meeting the requirements for media-shifted content. A successful audit means you will be identified as a "Certified Sound Choice Host."

If you haven't acquired music yet, or if you are looking for a great starter set, you would do well to check out the Sound Choice GEM Series. It's a great all-around set, and depending on how much of it you buy, you can get pretty good financing on it. However, other manufacturers have collections that might be more tailored to the needs of your crowd.

All of the above I've told you in my role as an attorney for SC. Some people say you should take it with a grain of salt for that reason. You should consult with an attorney of your choosing for advice specific to your situation. I'll be happy to speak with your attorney--just have him or her email me at jharrington (at) harringtonlawpc (dot) com.

Aside from that, I'll tell you also that while it's important to have good quality material for your patrons to sing to, and good sound equipment is a plus, your success or failure in this business will depend more on your abilities as a host, your understanding of how to operate the equipment smoothly and keep a show running, and your ability to sell your services to the venues who are your customers. I can't tell you how many times I've been to shows that were just terrible because the host had no charisma or professionalism.

In light of the new court decision concerning Slep-Tone v.s. Light Year Music aka The Kandy Store are audits going to really be necessary? I mean they will sort of be a thing of the past sort of like this whole legal process won't it Jim? As I remember when certification was the way to go in the whole state of Texas there was only one certified host wasn't there?

Yeah, there goes Harrington trying to sell you Sound Choice material. Don't get involved with them, unless you like being a pawn in their game. You can use ANY brand of Karaoke, and Sound Choice is the ONLY company who expects you to be audited for shifting their stuff to computer. That audit costs $150. If you want to use SC music just play it from disc. Much less of a head ache. Chartbuster will all want you to get an audit, which costs $175 and is good for one day.

The Gem series is a nice way to start, if you have the money. $4,500. They will finance you, but of course that comes with more cost. Then you are beholden to them every time you add some SC of your own. There is much more SC out there in the world than what is offered on the GEM series. The GEMs are only what they are ALLOWED by the licence holders, to sell today. If you go over 2% of what you had you will have to report in to SC like reporting into a parole officer. They want full control of what you are doing and what you own from them.

You could do what many new KJs are doing now. Buy some material, say DK, or even SC to start with, then use the single song downloads that are offered from companies like All Star Karaoke, Digitrax Entertainment, Tricerasoft, and the U.K. mfrs like Zoom. As your customers request stuff you can buy it, right then and there, if you have an internet connection. It's a nice way to go, you spend a little at a time, nobody will bother you about audits, and you collection, instead of being full of crap that nobody will ever sing, will be customer based so you know you are getting your money's worth.

I will agree with Harrington on one point, stay away from free downloads, iRC channels, and torrent sights. Also don't get scammed into buying a loaded hard drive. Beware of people offering you their collections to copy. That is dangerous. You don't want to get sued. It's just not worth it. That is why I would advise you to stay FAR away from SC and CB, unless you ONLY plan to use them on disc.

I wish you luck.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

BTW, do NOT, under ANY circumstances let people like Harrington tell you that it is ILLEGAL to run without being audited or any other nonsense like that. There is no law stating that you need to be audited by ANYONE in order to run a karaoke show.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

That's the whole point smooth nobody has to report to anyone anymore. Only the publisher's can sue for the content of the tracks. The manus themselves because of a recent jury verdict against SC can't sue for logo infringement unless a two part requirement is met. It would seem that the inmates were in charge of the asylum.


P.S. Just check out the thread below this one concerning the validity of SCDG's and everything will be explained without me having to go over it again . The same information is available on the Free Forum under the thread PRLLC and Digitrax Audits on page number three.

Mr. Harringgton and the Schleps are still hoping that there will be some KJs that are not in the loop and they will still succumb to the threats of being sued by the men behibd the curtain. The word will spread like wild fire and every KJ will walk into court with their attorneys carrying the judgement recently made against SWound Choice. After enough defendants are awarded court costs and legal costs, the once profitable grayv train will come to a screeching halt. It seems to me that the Karaoke Kandy Store broke every Sound Choice requirement and walked away with a big win against the mighty Goliath. Along with that big win, I'm sure was a big GRIN

You notice Bruce how all of the pro SC people don't want to be in the room with the 800 pound Gorilla? I have been trying to get Chris to respond to what CAVS told him and he has been running from forum to forum. You can run but you can't hide. Notice how when the heat is turned up Jim doesn't stick around and where is Insane? I guess the cat I mean the verdict got their tongues.

Although I don't support PR and dgitrax, I still support SC's right to decide whether or not a kj gets permission to run on computer. That is partly what ALL RIGHTS RESERVED is al about.

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The Line Array Experiment is over. Nothing to see here. Move along.

Holding that right, and trying to say that to be "legal" you have to be audited, as some have hinted at on this site and others, are two totally different things.

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

I think got scared off with the 20 paragraph answer to a simple question. Hoss, there IS no governing body that regulates karaoke. Just buy your music legally from download sites and you're good to go.

Yeah, what he said!!

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I am the ONLY SANE 1 HERE

You have to get away from the idea Danny the manus control anything anymore. The future of a hosts business is in their hands once more. The only problem is if the publishers start throwing their weight around, since they own all the tract content. I would think as long as the venue you work for is paying the proper fees to the publishers all would be well.

Lone Ranger - I have a full time day job that requires more time in a month than you probably put into 6 months of karaoke.

I have not had time to contact CAVS. But I also don't really care since the few SCDG's I have aren't even used. I don't use CAVS players.

btw....I don't run from anyone. But I also don't have to respond either. I am a reasonably transparent person, but I feel no pressure from you or anyone else to provide answers. If you want to call that running and attempting to hide, that is your opinion.

And finally......you are speculating TWICE this time.

I only read the verdict post moments ago. I don't sit, waiting for people to post so I can be the first to respond.

I am not jumping from forum to forum. I have not been active on the other forum in a very long time. I have only been logging in an dreading there again for about a week. My most recent post there is many months ago I believe. Long enough that I don't really remember.

That you sit and watch who is logged on tells me you have much, much more free time than I do.

-Chris

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-Chris

I think you are assuming too much. I believe the verdict is limited and KJ's can still be held liable.

How about you test it out for us if you are so confident? You only have two months left. You can probably get away with it.

-Chris

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-Chris

First, to the OP, Hoss:

Please keep in mind that Mr. Harrington is not only a representative of an ex-karaoke producer, but derives a variable income based on their current business model and how he can create part of that income.

Second, while much of what he posted is valid ( buy your music through legal channels, keep receipts, make sure you own the original media, etc..) when speaking of what Sound Choice wants, he is describing compliancy ( following guidelines that Sound Choice WISHES people to follow), NOT legality( laws set forth by a government or judicial body).

Now, another company- Piracy Recovery- who produces no product but whose business model- like the ex-producer Sound Choice- is litigation / audits for income, is offering audits of Chartbuster tracks ( for which they own the trademark) for $175.

As stated elswhere by those in contact with the company, this audit is " good for the day of the audit". In other words, it offers immunity from that company ONLY- NOT the music publisher/owner for ONE Day only- FOR $175.

Please also note that while karaoke producers may offer permissions to display their trademark, NONE of them can give permissions regarding usage- professionally or otherwise. That is the province of publishers/owners of the music- ONLY. While it could come in the future, right now the publishers/owners are not showing much interest in what KJs do.

An audit? If you don't mind paying for a "feel good". However, what you are really paying is a bribe. The karaoke producers cannot give permission to media shift tracks ( though they have say over their logo, it's unproven what they can do about it. For example, SC seems to be alienating some judges with their court actions with negative decisions and judicial statements towards them.), you are paying them- not for permission- but to pretend that they don't notice the media shift and supposedly won't tattle to the publishers ( like they would take the time to do that anyway, as the pubs haven't demonstrated any inclination to give a gnat's fart about it).

Up to you. Something else to think about. Part of what we charge as Karaoke Hosts is our time. Do you want - not only to give it away for free- but have them charge you on top of that?

My smallest event charge is $125/hr, 4 hr. min. If I were inclined to accept an audit, that would be the fee that I would have to be paid for my time. If, after that, I were to be found non-compliant, they would be free to add the expense to their suit. Doesn't that sound fair?

Now, the auditors will, of course, speak of their expenses and why they charge for an audit. My answer? Their expenses are not my problem. Their audit is not a requirement for my business, it's merely something that they wish for. So be it. They want my product (time), they pay for it. My product is as valuable to me as theirs is to them.

Just my ever humble opinions. Your mileage may vary...

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Danny, with all due respect, the above is the crux of the problem: SC HAS NO RIGHT to decide whether or not a kj gets permission to run on computer. They get bribed to turn a blind eye- they CAN'T give permission for professional KJ usage ( except maybe the logo display- BUT NOT THE TRACK).

As for "All Rights Reserved": That only means all rights that they are entitled to, not universal rights.

People should really learn to read labels, by the way.

Example: "No Unauthorized Copies" does NOT mean no copies, it means that no copies can be made for unauthorized usage. Completely different. Duplicating a disc for a single site back-up is authorized. Duplicating a disc for multi-site use is not. See the difference?

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"No Contests, No Divas, Just A Good Time!"

" Disc based and loving it..."

Come on Chris if a company that is in business selling preloaded hard drive machines can't be held liable for trademark infringement, how are they going to hold venues and KJ's guility of trademark infringement? They aren't selling any product that might be confused as original manu items, they are only providing a service or entertainment. If some manu decides to sue me I will get a copy of this decision and give it to a lawyer go into to court and have the manu pay the costs of the trial like Light Year Music aka The Kandy Store did. If every host does that how long do you think the legal process scam is going to continue? You notice you don't see Jim Harrington even commenting on this decision although he has been on this forum. Even the in your face Insane is silent. I think the game is finally going the other way and it is only of matter of time before the players realize it and cut their losses. I seem to recall that I once wrote that if one of these trials went to a jury then we would find how legitimate the manus legal standing is, well we found out didn't we?