Karaoke Forums

I apologize in advance if this is a duplicative topic, but I couldn't find one that was general enough.

I've been doing karaoke in my bar for many years, buying the discs and hiring the KJs. I finally broke down and installed a computer system (desktop PC in the office, peripherals hardwired through the ceiling, MTU software). It works great. Thanks to many for all the help. Special shout-out to Lonman who helped me get off the dime on this thing. I did the HELP licensing on my SC discs. I have about 5,000 unique songs.

Because I was using discs, I haven't bothered to buy new songs for many moons, anticipating I'd go another way. So I have a decent budget to build up the book, including what we haven't spent in the past. So far my method is to accept requests, buy them 'while-you-wait' from Karaoke Versions, and add them to the book. At least the newly purchased songs will get sung once. My first week, this cost me $129, which is fine for a while, but I'm competing with people with huge selections that they probably didn't pay for and I can't do that forever at that price.

So I'm looking at alternatives:
1) Buying from other sources that are cheaper, if any.
2) Making 'bulk purchases' of songs we should have, at a lower per-song price, in hopes that people will request them, if that option even exists.
3) Buying CDs in bulk on EBay and transferring them to the new system.
4) Buying MP3s or other formats on legally sold media, resold on Ebay.
5) ? You tell me.

How the heck are people doing this? I considered charging a small fee to download tunes, and some customers even suggested it, but I'm not sure it's viable while other people are offering seemingly endless libraries for free to their singers.

Thanks in advance for your help.

I'd opt for #3.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

If you have a mostly older crowd . . . bulk cd

Mixed . . . buy bargains and also download to order as you've been doing.

Under 30 - float that you can dl it right now from x karaoke website and it's only x dollarsl
8 times out of 10 under 30's will throw 5 bucks at you and say "I want it . . . Keep the change"
If they don't, you still have the option of DL'ing it and paying for it yourself without confronting them.

Just curious.... Why did you get the HELP licensing instead of getting an Audit from PEP/SC and become listed as being Certified? Since you are providing the Library, the only reasons I could see for you getting a HELP License would be:
1. You have (and are using) some SC tracks for which you do not own the discs,
2. You are running more than one system with the same set of SC discs.
3. The KJ's you are hiring are also using their library of songs along with yours.

I bought the certification quite some time ago, and haven't completed the audit because the system was assembled last week. I thought it was the 'HELP' program, but maybe not. What I paid for was labels to certify my discs, which are duplicated on one system.

What you did, apparently, was obtain provisional certification pending and audit.

This is what you do if you own an original SC cd+g disk for every track you've copied to your 1 system. This is what it means to be 1:1. You pay once for the certification/audit and you're done.

The "HELP" license is for operators who don't want to deal with the audit for whatever reason (not opening that can of worms here) and want to use copies of SC tracks without fear of reprisal from SC.

If you own the discs... the only logical reason to license through the HELP process would be to duplicate your SC library on to more than one system. If you opened a second location for example.

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Never the same show twice!

MtnKaraoke, what you're describing is exactly what I've done, so it's not the HELP program. I registered quite some time ago because it was apparently a limited time offer (even though I wasn't quite ready to pull the trigger), and they sent me some labels. We just started using the tracks, and I intend to attach the labels and arrange the audit soon.

Starting with my 5K or so songs, I'm just wondering how to go forward. I don't mind paying for downloads, but I can't do it forever at three bucks a shot. I have a sense that the illegal operators have created an expectation that there's no book and you can do anything you want for free, so it's hard to charge.

I'd like to have a model where there's no book and we just download everything, but I haven't found an affordable way to do it in the long run.

There is absolutely no reason in this day to 'build up the book' to give an illusion of a bigger book. A bigger book does not mean bigger or even better selection. It's a matter of having what people WANT to sing is what's important. You say you already have 5000 songs or so, decent 'core' base, then buy songs on request as needed. You will need a wifi connection (many bars have free wifi or get an unlimited hot spot plan for your smart phone) and i'd recommend a separate computer to download - but it can be done on the show computer (just do not like submitting it to internet).

I'd recommend buying songs you do not have that people are asking you for. Have a clipboard so they can write down their requests and go from there.

I would never charge a singer to buy a song they want to sing - this is a kj's ongoing expense, not the singers responsibility. And often times that request will be done by more than just that one requester. Other times that song will be done only once - but then you'll be glad you only paid $3 for it as opposed to $30 for a disc for that song with nothing else needed on that disc either.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Not completely, however most legal kj's do in fact buy on request and download instantly. $3 per track that is wanted/used by a singer is much better than the days where we paid $30 for a disc for only 1 sing needed.

I still like to see books when I go to a show, but you can go bookless with the phone app options so people can browse and search for songs on their phone.
I prefer SongbookDB.com you can see my book as an example using dj code Lonman Productions

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Most karaoke singers aren't particularly ambitious about expanding their repertoire.

If you make a personal connection the same people will keep coming back and singing the same songs.

So starting out you might be buying a lot of downloads, but if you keep the same people coming back you'll be buying less every week.

Depends on the singers I suppose. Most of our singers do like trying new stuff often. I have a couple handfuls that have the same songs everytime they come in. 1 guy just topped over 1000 songs in his history, another is almost to 900, while the majority of my regs have anywhere from 250-500 songs in their history on avg. I have bought over 1000 new tracks alone this year, 75% of those were requests, the rest were on bulk buys I found.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Great info! So where are the bulk buys? Are we talking about buying discs and transferring, or are there bulk buys online that are worthwhile?

I use a desktop computer with a hardwired high-speed internet connection, since I don't have to move it around. On your advice, I paid for a license for a second MTU computer but haven't built it yet. How do you configure that? My KJ told me that you can download songs but not import them while people are singing. It hasn't been a problem, but it would be nice to have a solid backup.

Bulk buys off of e-bay, craigslist of people/former kj's selling a lot of discs for cheap (ie $.50-2.00 per discs depending on the quantity) and essentially grab bag stuff - basically you know brands included, sometimes disc numbers and even rarer - an actual song list, but unless you want to research each and every disc first to find out exactly what is on each one you kind of take your chances. Cost can still run over the $1000 mark if there are a lot of discs included - I keep what I don't have then re-sell the rest as individual discs at $10-20 per disc which sometimes nets me back what I spent in the entire buy if I have a bunch of duplicate discs.
And yes talking about bulk used discs and manually transferring them to the computer.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Depending on which license you originally had, you might not have needed to purchase a 2nd copy.
But anyway, as far as on the fly downloads, no you cannot add those songs to your database while people are singing. I use a flashdrive from my download computer, bring it to my show computer and import it via the K-Oke (for zips, mp3g, kma, kmh, etc.) and Video (for video formats) buttons depending on which format i'm downloading. Search the flashdrive you inserted and pick the song you just downloaded which will add it to the playlist and this CAN be done while people are singing. I take a few minutes the next day to add all new songs to the actual database.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

I just wish I had singers with that kind of repertoire. Most of mine top out around 10 songs. I try to get them to try new songs, but a lot of them are too scared to do it.

1) You can contact Colin (Sunfly) directly and deal for their entire SF library in Mp3+G or HD 14000+ songs all in 320 bit rate quality for about $0.50 cents /song.

2) Or if you like the SC brand, make a deal with Pep.rocks for the Gem set on payments and still have a Help license in place untill Gem is fully paid.

3) karafun subscription or Karaokemediapro subscription.

4) ebay has Mp3+g karaoke cd's from 4 cents per song.

In the U.S. only one tenth of their library is available on their North America website. I hope that seriously changes.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

Another option where you would have access to instantly download new tracks is KJ Media Pro from KaraokeWare. It works in conjunction with their hosting software, CompuHost.

The tracks are stored on your PC. Tracks are from Chartbuster/Digitrax. You set up an account and buy credits in advance. If a singer requests a song you don't have and it's available, you will be asked if you'd like to use a credit to unlock it. If you say yes, the song is automatically unlocked, and it's starts playing instantly. The whole process takes literally seconds with no delay. After unlocked, it is added to your library and you own it.

The program is awesome and will save you time, money and best of all, you don't have to rely on an internet connection. The only drawback would be if you're not already using it, you must have CompuHost, which in my opinion is the most awesome hosting software ever. Once you have CompuHost, there's even an option for people to use their Smart Phone to turn in their song requests. I use both and love it. So do my customers.

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Electro-Voice Evolve 50... Taking Sound To The Next Level.

I'm sorry but i must debate on if not oppose to using KJmedia Pro. They sell their tracks for 20-30x higher price. You can buy the exact same songs direct from ebay sellers for 5 cents a song.

Not to be confused with karaoke media pro offering 29000+ songs for $60/month.