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I try to get some example of how other's feel about equipment by reading "shoot-outs", "Consumer's Guides", and online reviews.. Yet if you read a "shoot-out", how objective are the editor's, and reviewers in the Guitarist and electronics publications ?  Don't alot of these magazines do business with certain companies ? Similarly from the look's of things in Consumer's, I wonder if they get revenue from Sony, and Samsung and Toshiba...These companies seem to consistently do well in reviews, which surprizes me... Are there review's a person can read that might be relatively impartial ?   Sort've like going to Harmony Central and reading review's on guitar's, yet the people that bother writing review's either want to slam someone they are angry at, or "My new Charvel ReWlz, it's a 10 !!!",  If anyone know's of somewhat impartial "shoot-outs", I'd love to know where I can find them...Last thing I want to do is read what I think is an honest review, and find out the editor doing the writeups, is told to favor the Epiphone Guitar for "Overall Bang for Buck in midrange priced production semi-hollow bodies" because Epiphone is a huge sponsor of theirs.  Same with consumer and pro-lines of audio equipment. While I believe that most of what's presented here is based upon the honest opinions of those who've actually used product's, there are MANY product-lines out there.. How can we know what's what so that we can actually feel we did the best we can given our price range ?   In local stores we are limited to only a few head-to-head comparison's we can personally do, yet that's a drop in the bucket.....and while we compare these products even online, we often aren't hearing what people feel about the "Mail order Only" companies such as Carvin, Bose, and many others....IS THERE such a thing as a broad spectrum shoot-out in the electronic's area ?   or must we jump around and read numerous review's and keep our finger's crossed that the people reviewing are presenting actual opinion, and not just scratching someone's back, or thrilled and writing an elated presentation based upon their new adult toy that they just want to show-off, which just arrived in the mail ? Now I'm sure many "get out" ALOT more than others. If you live within close proximity to a larger city you get ALOT more exposure to bar equipment, and larger retail establishments than some of us get in the "burbs", or rural areas

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Steven,

As you suspected, most of the reviews you read are sales hype and the result of the almighty dollar....Just like the top 40 you listen to on the radio-you see/hear what the highest bidder paid for you to see/hear.

It is difficult to sort it all out sometimes....Many forums are populated by "gear snobs" and the others just follow along like sheep in fear they will be rejected if they counter the snobs opinion.

Behringer ticked off a lot of folks when they stole other makers designs...all that got sorted out in court eventually, but it left a lasting impression in the industry with the pro  studios....So don't ever expect any pro level types to endorse Behringer in the foreseeable future.

You've heard me say this before, and now maybe you know why I say it....Talk to the guys at sweetwater whenever you think you need a piece of MI gear....Not only can they help you select the exact configuration based on what you are attempting to do, they can also tell you their personal experience with the different brands....That's about as close as you can get to finding someone in your hood with experience.

It's like Carvin, many never heard of them.  I had some experience & shared my opinion - actually use almost ALL Carvin amps now, soon to be 100%.  Their speakers rock the house, don't have any personally but used plenty of them in my band - had 2 dual 15" with 2 dual 18" subs on each side quad amp'd with 4 Carvin DCM2000 amps & 2 DCM1000 amps.
Got some here converted as well & they couldn't be happier.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Thanks Keith,  It appears that without years of "Hands-on" experience directly with MANY brands, and without living a life where you are surrounded by soundgear, and people who've made the transition into the digital realm, reading can lead to more confusion, at least initially,  eventually things begin to fall in place... If I still made the frequent trips into NYC, I'd have more of a clue from personal experience. Seems that so many on the internet either (as you say) want to follow the flock, or in some cases, be the different voice, and play devil's advocate.. Yet to know when a presentation is objective is tough.  What scares me is that as much as I love reading musical gear reviews over in Harmony Central, the feeling I come away with, is that predominantly those that want to give straight 10 ranks, or 1 ranks to certain musical equipment, are generally those that bother taking the time to write the reviews....and I've never seen so many pieces of equipment that I personally think are subpar get rave reviews... What's scarier, is that when you read about 10 review's you frequently find that about three of those ten reviews just happen to have the same sentence structure, grammatical error's, and are identicle in composition.. Funny thing is, they are all written by different SN's  :shock:

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Yep,

And what complicates the issue even more is the fact that all makers produce certain items that are absolute flops....and then add the fact that the gear scene is always changing due the rapid advancement in tech and new product introduction....A guy just can't keep up!

another thing to consider is how long a particular item has been in production....The ART Pro Channel I just bought has been produced 7 years so far...That's a very long time in the MI world....So that had a lot to do with my decision....

BBE on the other hand, seems to change every 6 months....You can't gage the publics reaction and experience when that's going on.

BBE Sonic Maximizer just does a face change every few years, the circuitry now days is essentially the same as it was when it came out - why mess with a good thing.  They have added some new processors over the years that may or may not stand the test of time.  The their SM circuitry is being used in more than just pro gear these days.  I have it in my JVC TV, my cousin had a car stereo with the BBE lo & process control & it's even being built into some head units as well.

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LIKE Lonman on Facebook - Lonman Productions Karaoke & my main site via my profile!

Nope,

Their "process" is actually chip based, and they quite frequently upgrade their chips...Many older BBE's are totally obsolete and can't be repaired due to no chips avail...and when I say "older", I'm talking just a few years old....The BBE site explains it fully.

The BBE tech you see included in other products is done thu license..It also changes rapidly. Peavey also licenses their Kosmos process for use in other audio products....you will see it soon, if not already, in home audio stuff like surround sound and bookshelf stereos.

Now, is that a bad thing that BBE is always upgrading and that your old BBE is not repairable?....Not really....BBE is an agressive company that gives you their very lastest....And they recently started offering lifetime warranty....That's a warranty that says they will fix it or replace it free....So if they no longer make it, you get the latest.

There is a joke in the MI world where a guy asks, "Whats the BBE of the month this month?"

I guess at the rate digital electronic's is advancing, nothing stay's similar for a long enough timespan to draw "like item" comparisons, Unless you can stay 10 steps behind cutting edge. Compare 6 comparably featured items, and they've become obsolete, by time you've had a chance to study them. something newer is out so there's no real "test of time", and someone has created a for-runner that soon someone else will perfect.. It does feel like trying to keep up while following a race... Those of us that were around awhile back can say that "where thing's left off", and eventually plateau'd Marantz, McIntosh, Harmon-Kardon, Altec, Thorens, Tannoy, EV, Bozak (and Nakamichi seems to have gained more respect than it had years ago), stood the test of time in analog.  

In the 25 (or-so) years since analog, alot of the older stuff that's stopped evolving and has lasted is easier to view with more objectivity. Yet that raises another situation which is "cutting edge product" does not always equate with "better product", It get's confusing as to what's ended production because it's actually obsolete, or what's been discontinued because it's cost prohibitive to keep in production (tube technology). Not everything that's sold as "state of the art" is better than before...Yet the past equipment becomes a limited and retrospective market that's easier to review once it's leveled off. Seems it wasn't until about 3 1/2 years ago that computer technology started appearing to level off... Between 1993 and 1998 I'd already gone from a new 386-SX system thru the DX, 486 Sx, Dx-2, DX-4, P-33, P-66, P-90 etc.. to a P-2 new with ALOT of advancments in capacity made over a relatively short time-span... DOS became obsolete, Windows 3.11 came  and went, and Windows 95, 98, etc...offered expansion options in software, yet at the same time also took up ALOT more storage capacity, so did the newer systems really run faster ?  prices of technology were plummeting every 6 months... Yet the computer I'm on now, which I bought from XP bargains 3 years ago, is still around the same price...Still a P-4 , 256 RAM,  40 gig HD... AOL was version 9 when I bought this, and it still is version 9.. and although you can get a P-4 system with more RAM, faster processor, and larger HD today for that same price as my system was,  compared to the leaps and bounds, and rate technology became obsolete between the early and late 90's. technological advancement's and price-drops to the consumer today have started leveling off in the computer market recently....It's just easier to buy and afford a computer today, companies have folded, and if you look at the size drop in "Computer Shopper" today, it's an easier market to play in than it was a decade ago.. Now it's video electronics that people spend more money in, and telecom areas, HDTV has hit, Digital cable is fast growing and Consumer and Pro audio/video seems to be where many companies are expending time and energy in R&D these days, and the digital electronics market is finding ways to pace itself so it can hang-in with this area... When advancement becomes tough to market, The better companies develop cheap import technology and hope their past names will enable them to stay affloat... Marantz came back in the mid-90's hoping their name which gained notoriety from the analog era, would enable them to sell alongside the better makes such as better Onkyo, and Dennon DTS receivers that never dropped out for home theatre A/V.. Yet rather than drop out've the race, the better companies that hung tough just about all created a cheaper line to cater to a different segment of buyer.. These companies know what they are doing it seems.

It get's tough knowing who makes the good product in what price bracket these days.. By the time you hope to integrate a system which consists of multiple components, you are starting at square 1 again.


Just trying to understand what's going on out loud, sorry about the rant.


Just one other tidbit that I found interesting.. I was over in the NASA site about 6-7 months back trying to find trivia such as how close to an actual launchpad spectators are allowed to get for viewing (given safety aspects), and what happens during a rocket launch..etc..(this was around the time of the shuttle landing)..Ended up reading that the computers used during the 1960's first Apollo moon walk, although massive in size, were roughly capable of doing that which most of our home-systems can do today.  As of last summer, home PC capability was really no more advanced in terms of capability than the systems our government used in the 60's. Although computer rooms and storage area's were massive in those days.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

And do you know how long Carvin has been around ?   Probably 60 years ! They are one of the nations oldest guitar manufacturers still operating today.  Around 1979 I bought this, tag sale for $10 (not sure if it's an 8 string Hawaian Guitar, Mellobar, or just Lap Steel) I think it's around a 1957 Carvin.. Was made in the Covina Ca. Factory.. .Anyway just to give some authenticity to this I added my signature...Took this around 1/2 hour ago....
Anyway, 10 years ago I called Carvin, in hopes they'd have some info on what the heck this thing was I had....They weren't overly friendly...Not sure why...They just don't like answering questions like this I suppose... I did a search, this is around '57...As I recall, it was the style of the Logo, and the fact that this was an 8-string Lap steel (or Hawaian) guitar that made it evident as to it's vintage. Carvin didn't produce this type thing for long..


(suppose to read "KS Bites XOXOX Kappy")


.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".

Vintage Guitar Magazine.



Carvin’s against-the-grain manufacturing and marketing approach has been incongruous, and it has served the company well ever since founder Lowell Kiesel began building pickups in his Los Angeles garage in 1946.

The history of Carvin has already been covered in VG’s “The Different Strummer” (VG, August ’92), and the growth of the Southern California manufacturer over the decades has resulted in several relocations of manufacturing facilities. The company moved to Covina in 1949, then to Escondido in ’67, and in ’95 it occupied a new 80,000 square-foot facility in San Diego.

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Northeast United States runner up for the "Singing Hall of Shame".